Wow. I can honestly say that I don't think anyone is surprised by the creativity of women nowadays, but the whole women working thing is definitely still alive and well in my little world. Women who work and think all women should work, versus women who stay home and think all women should stay home, versus women who work part-time (me) and who think all women should mind their own business.

I don't believe men have to deal with that at all, do they?

Not to nearly the extent women have to, I think. But thoughtful men such (such as The Murr) think constantly about how to balance their work ambitions with their family's money needs with their need for family time and a happy mind (formula: golf).

But no, nobody's telling me how much or how little I should work, and I don't think I'm as acutely conflicted about it as my wife (who works four hard days a week as a teacher and whose unmarried, childless principal wants her to work five even though she "totally" understands "the work-family balance thing").

Eileen,

Men have to deal with it on a different level. You should see the looks and hear the sometimes rude comments I get when some folks find out my wife doesn't work, and never has. It's not that I go around broadcasting it (OK, I just did) but some nosy people in the workplace just have to know these things. I never could figure out where they were coming from.

Will

Some of this, Will, might just be an honest inability to understand the decisions of others.

I may have been guilty of doing a double-take when anyone, mom or dad, has told me they don't work, but rather stay home with the kids.

(In fact, I had to restrain myself from writing the insulting "just" in between "rather," and "stay" in the previous sentence.)

It's not because I don't know how much work that is--but precisely BECAUSE I know how much work it is, and how grinding it can be--that I gape, mostly in: "How do you do it without going mad?"

When the work day's over, I'm so happy to be with my kid. When I finally pack my kid off in the morning, I'm so happy to go to work. So as someone who lives a life of always moving between two pursuits, I just honestly have a hard time imagining having "just" one job.

(And since work is so much more varied--at least my work is--it's easier for me to imagine "just" doing that than it is to imagine "just" being with the little lamb.)

So I'm more CURIOUS than judgmental, but you might interpret my reaction otherwise .....

The thing is, David, I would stop working in a heartbeat and stay home full-time with the kiddos if I didn't have to work. Of course, I'd still write, and maybe that's why it seems so appealing.

But I don't know many men who feel that way. I realize I'm pissing off numerous feminists, but I just think we're different that way.

Except my friend Andy's uncle, a genius who could be making millions but instead quit his job to stay at home and start a "Think Tank" on his own. His wife's been working full-time ever since. As my husband said when he heard this, "Oh, that we could all quit and start a "Think Tank." I agree.

The older I get, the more dumb decisions I make with the best of intentions, and the more I get to know people whose decisions secretly made me tear my hair out, the less inclined I am to judge ANYONE. Judgmental people are ALL JERKS! :-) (Hey! I'm putting that on a t-shirt!)

I do think men and women have their own crosses to bear in juggling work and family. Women are often their own worst enemies, dragging each other down when they could be lifting each other up, but men--at least American men--do the same. They seem to equate their career success with their self-worth, and they lay that burden on each other.

Have you ever heard, when being introduced to someone, "John/Mary is currently engaged in raising the kindest, best-adjusted kids in town?" Bet not. It's something we all SAY we value above everything else, but our behavior says otherwise.

I really think this is another of those things where we have to patient while our (north american) societal norms and sub-conscious culture conditioning catch up with our best intentions.

Jane is correct - we all SAY that raising great kids is the most important job etc. etc. but the sacrifices involved in actually DOING that job to the utmost are harder than many people can appreciate particularly if someone else's choice is different from yours.

And I think men have their own challenges in this arena as several folks have mentioned. If you've never been in a meeting where a "career guy" announced that he would be resigning to be a full-time stay at home Dad (his wife made substantially more $$ at HER high-powered job) let me tell you the reaction is something to see (by the women even more than the men)

Again to second Jane - if we could all just smile and say sincerely "Good for you!" when someone tells us what they've decided to do (work outside the home, not work outside the home, work part-time whatever) we would all be a happier bunch. However, people and societies change slowly. Calling people on rude and thoughtless comments is a good way to help things along while we wait.

The sweetest revenge is to find a way to be pleased and at ease with one's own choices. As pleased and at ease as one can be, anyway--and fake the rest.

Or, as the Versatile Lady who raised me used to say, "Fuck them if they can't take a joke."

When my wife and I started out, Kim was a career-oriented person, who was advancing at a downtown Chicago commercial real estate firm. She kept working when our son was born, but something did change over time. She was less happy at work, and kept expressing the desire to be at home, raising a family.

When our second (and I believe last) child, Caitlyn, was born, Kim and I were working on a plan to allow her to be a full-time parent. (I know, the rest of you consider yourselves full-time, but like David said, you get to hide at the office for several hours each day).

Kim moved from a full-time position, to part-time positions as a Pampered Chef "consultant" and then a member of our church's paid staff. Our plans hit a bump when I unexpectedly lost my job a few years ago. We actually are still recovering financially, and Kim has had to continue to work part-time.

Nothing would drive her more crazy than having our kids home all summer without one of us around to parent them. Nothing would drive me more crazy than for that person to be me.

As my wife's school kids say, "I feel ya, Tom. I feel ya."

My son says stuff like "I feel ya" too. I really wouldn't last a week before I lost it.

I left IBM three weeks after my daughter was born and have never looked back. I probably make less money than if I'd stayed, but the dividends are awesome.

Yes, reactions vary when I mention that I'm a part-time househusband, but only two opinions really matter here: mine and my daughter's.

David, you and I have talked about it in the past -- and we both feel we have the best of both worlds. True, many people define "success" in terms of money, title and prestige, but for me, there's no prestige greater than when people remark how great my daughter is.

They're right, of course.

I used to think it sad that I was virtually the only Dad who'd show up to sit in on my daughter's classes during "back to school" week. But then I realized that what's great for me may not be as fulfilling or appropriate for someone else. And that's okay. "Your mileage may vary."

I'm just glad that I can play a meaningful role in her life. And even devote some time to being a Blood Ambassador in the community. If it means staying up half the night to catch up on work, so be it. So what if I'm exhausted? It gives me both empathy and understanding for whomever (woman or man) devotes their time to raising the kid(s). I may be tired, but I feel good.

Nicely said, Mike. I never take my freelance freedom for granted. Not for one single day. Every day I have it--every day that I knock off at 4:00 to pick up Scout and trundle her onto the subway and walk a half-mile home with her on my shoulders is money in the bank as a Dad.