I would laugh at Dear Mr. Rumsfeld, except this is so incredibly SCARY. Delusions of grandeur doesn't even begin.

And on a somewhat related note, I don't think of you as the Churchill of Comms, more like the Beatles. Perhaps we could arrange for a screaming, fainting throng at your next conference introduction?

another big difference: the voters kicked Churchill out _after_ the war was over, and thankfully this turkey has been given the boot now. I look forward to the movie he makes in 20 years, about how bad he feels now, how all those dead soldiers weigh on his conscience... blah blah blah.
maybe they could call the movie "The Fog of the Unknown Unknowns"

I found another of Rummy's parting comments typically annoying; the one where he said how complicated and hard for the unwashed masses to understand the current war effort is. So it's not that he screwed it up, it's that we're all so dimwitted we can't see the utter brilliance of his "plan." Evidently, the Iraqis can't see it either, as they seem ever more intent on blowing each other -- and any U.S. military personnel they can find as well -- to bits.

I used to think Rummy reminded me of my dear, departed Uncle Don, but I've come to realize that any resemblance is purely physical. Unlike Rummy, Uncle Don actually served in the military; and unlike Rummy, Uncle Don didn't always come off like he thought he was the smartest guy in the room.

Greg

Oddly enough, I just read a biography on Churchill, and it proves Rummy to be correct in one sense (but not in the way he'd like) and horribly wrong. The comparison is legitimate in that Churchill, like Rumsfeld, was also considered a warmonger who was even looking to start another war right after WWI. He was a rogue who changed parties, was ousted from several high-ranking positions, and even shut out of politics altogether (I think in the mid-30s) by the people and his peers.

But when England felt that they basically HAD to go to war, they knew there was only one man for the job - the fearless Winston Churchill. And here's the crucial point - Churchill was the right man to fight the right war at the right time. And when the war was over, it was time to take him out again (although he was voted back in again in the 50s, I think).

Anyway, if anyone's interested, Sebastian Haeffner's Churchill is a short, easy-to-read biography (unlike some of those 1,000 pagers out there) of a heroic, flawed, complicated, sometimes brilliant and inspirational, sometimes careless and power-hungry man. You know that line in Gatsby about there being no 2nd act in American lives? Churchill had, like, 87 different acts, all of them interesting.

And you know what his last words were? "I'm bored with it all."

The only comparisson I can think to make between Rummy and The Church is the fact that both gentlemen possess taints.

I do not claim to be well versed in the history of dear Winston outside of what he did for England in WWII. Why do I know what he did in WWII? Because his deeds were taught in my history class in High School about how he pretty much saved England and helped win the war.

In the year 2025 when some kid is sitting at his desk, between downloading the new Nirvana single to his nPod (nPod is the neural iPod - straight download into the brain and yes Nirvana will still be putting out albums) and fiddling with his new eyeball piercing -- the holographic instructor will tell him to download his lesson for the day about the worst debacle in American history orchestrated by the smarmiest tool to ever step foot in old Washington D.C. - Rumsfeld (In January 2007 President Bush orders nukes to be dropped on the greatest threat to America's freedoms -- the pilots oblige)

So I guess we found another comparrison, in a few years he will he be part of history lessons -- the arrogant smarmy asshat that he is.

Uhmmm does anyone else buy this excuse that he stepped down because America showed with this election that we don't approve of the war? Haven't we been pretty vocal that we thought this was a bad manuver from the get go?

Or is it just a way to steal press? I know I stopped talking about the Democrats taking control of the houses as soon as this story broke.

Steve,
you're funnier when you stick to topics you know. Stay away from political and military history...you don't know shit. Read Caleb Carr's "Lessons of Terror" if you actually want to know shit...Rumsfeld is the only government official in modern times who has tried to reform the World's military response to terrorism...
Not an orator...but quietly insightful although largely ineffective. Churchill's efforts were more spectacular but equally ineffective.

Dee:

I'm familiar with Carr's work. Basically, he says that terrorism has never worked, and that we have to treat terrorists as soldiers, not criminals, and act accordingly.

Which is all fine and good. I'll read Lessons of Terror. And I actually have a copy of his Sherlock Holmes novel, THe Italian Secretary, on my nightstand that I haven't gotten to. I'll read that tout suite, too.

In fact, I'll read every damn word Caleb Carr has ever written. THen I'll go back and re-read all the neoconservative papers from Wolfowitz, et. al (the folks the first Bush called "the crazies in the basement"), then I'll listen to Rush and Sean "you're a good American" Hannity for a while.

THEN, maybe I'll know shit.

But I'll still never compare Donald Rumsfeld to Winston Churchill.

Steve C.

Wow, that was harsh.

I've actually got that book on my reading list, Dee, but given the way everything has played out, it would take a lot to change my wildly popular opinion that Rumsfeld is a horse's ass. Insightful maybe, but so was Karl Marx. And we all know how that played out.

Valarie - thanks for the heads up on that Churchill book - I've got a long standing love for the historical biography/autobiography having read several books on the Russian revolution when I was very young (7th grade maybe)...I was obsessed with Anastasia and the entire royal family. It's been a secret passion ever since. It's nice to know there's a book on Churchill that won't see me to my grave. :)

Didn't mean it to be harsh...I use expletives with abandon and I know Steve appreciates them as well-placed adjectives as well. I probably shouldn't write comments "post-martinis" but alas...

It just seems like so much piling on...as if Rumsfeld was the only knucklehead in this misguided effort, when in fact, he might have been right and just been the victim of a his own poor PR.

US Sec Def...probably the toughest single job in the World...maybe tougher than President. Carr's historical analysis and perspective teaches a lot about how bright people have been screwing this up for centuries.

Didn't mean to attack Steve. I don't know shit either but I do know that all of this wasn't Rumsfeld's fault. And I'm damn certain that one of George's H's old CIA cronies ain't the answer either.

Rebecca:

It was a little harsh . . . but you have to forgive those on the right for being a tad crabby these days.

I don't want anyone to think I'm this gung-ho Churchill fan with blinders on. I actually did get through Manchester's "The Last Lion" series, or most of it anyway. And I've read The Private Lives of Winston Churchill by John Pearson.

I don't mean to say Churchill was without his flaws. Like most of us, his flaws exceeded his strong points, probably.

And Rumsfeld did some good things.

But to compare the two----or, more importantly, for Rumseld to compare himself to his idol, Churchill----is ridiculous.

And thanks for the book suggestion, Valarie. I'm going to pick that one up, too. I'm always looking for more on the man . . . especially after going to that War Rooms museum in London. What an unbelievable place that is.

Steve C.

Dee:

You better not stop posting post-martinis!! That means I'll have to stop posting post-matinis, which will cut down significantly on how often I can post.

I agree with you: there is too much piling on, and it certainly ISN'T 100 percent Rumsfeld's point.

I actually sort of LIKE Rumsfeld. I like anyone who gives good quote. I liked that he stuck it to the media. I liked that he had the strength of his convictions, unlike some people who blow in whatever wind the polls tell them to blow in.

I like all of that about him, and I think he knows his shit.

But I also think he didn't get the job done, and was a little too stubborn to keep in there.

Steve C.

One thing to remember about Rumsfeld, though. He never served. He was actively involved in our two biggest debacles of the last 100 years. And he didn't do dick to get our troupes enough armor or the other things they needed to stay safe as well as fight a war.

OK, maybe that was more than one. I'm a military wife, so I'm biased. But when the military doesn't trust their SecDef, there's a MAJOR problem. I've been doing a happy dance since the resignation was announced.

And as for comparing himself to Churchill? Is anyone truly surprised? The man is a pompous, self-aggrandizing ass.

Has anyone ever seen the Slate article that puts Rumsfeld's comments in poetry form? It'll make your day. It's at http://www.slate.com/id/2081042/. Here's a sample:

Glass Box
You know, it's the old glass box at the—
At the gas station,
Where you're using those little things
Trying to pick up the prize,
And you can't find it.
It's—

And it's all these arms are going down in there,
And so you keep dropping it
And picking it up again and moving it,
But—

Some of you are probably too young to remember those—
Those glass boxes,
But—

But they used to have them
At all the gas stations
When I was a kid.

—Dec. 6, 2001, Department of Defense news briefing

So it IS the same Caleb Carr that penned "The Alienist"??? THAT is an awesome book! I would highly recommend that, Steve, if you already have interest in "The Italian Secretary." I've been meaning to get to that one, too. I see a bookstore run on my lunch hour. Should be a good weekend for wine and reading.

Post-martini commenting would mean I'd be drinking at work, which really appeals to me, but is unfortunately impossible. For a geek, I don't get on the 'puter much at home!

I think politics is a lot like looking at a marriage from the outside. A couple breaks up and everyone is like "Oh she was a bitch" or "he was a loser!" But the truth is, no one really knows what's going on in that house. Politics is the same - even with the ever-involved media, the gen pop is still subjected to a lot of he-said,she-said finger pointing and piling on. Rummy made a lot of bad decisions in my book, and didn't make it any better with his "quick wit." I don't think history will see him as a great tactician (is that a word?) and definitely not a good secdef.

Well, I remember watching Churchill's funeral. I suspect Rummy's will come up a tad short. Not much of a comparison.

But in Rummy's defence, I think it IS fair ball for him to quote the person who said "I have never lacked for criticism" - it's just that on realizing it was Churchill he should have said, "Um, maybe we won't use that one."

This is also another drop into the bucket that means public figures are increasingly being pushed into NEVER ad-libbing, because we'll deconstruct every syllable.

Dear Steve,
Don and Mr Churchill have a lot in common. They both had bulldogs, they both had huge egos, they both smoked cigars and they both had teeny weeny....

See there's more to this comparison stuff than accomplishments and political ideology.

I think when Don compared himself to Churchill, he was really trying to say "What about them Bears!"

This really was a pre, post and during martini response.